The state of infusion

A place for discussion about Nexus Clash game mechanics, including Build Advice.
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oath2order
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Re: The state of infusion

Post by oath2order »

Huojin wrote: Fri Jun 17, 2022 11:08 am Yeah, there's no benefit for Good (or Unaligned) in holding territory, except denying it to Evil and making their lives slightly easier. We need some kind of end-game content there for the other alignments to actually provide an incentive.

Just while we're on the topic of infusion more generally though - to the extent it's retained in its current form, please can we make it a grindable thing? I'm sure some limits would have to be put in place, but it would make it at least a little more appealing if there was some long term benefit.
"Denying it to Evil" is literally what I've been doing for my faction in our current battle.
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Alkasyn
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Re: The state of infusion

Post by Alkasyn »

Considering how ussually it's more fun to get something, even small, ourselves, than it is to make so that omeone else doesn't get anything, I think this should definitely be revamped.
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oath2order
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Re: The state of infusion

Post by oath2order »

SaltedSalmon wrote: Sat Jun 18, 2022 10:39 am
cat wrote: Sat Jun 18, 2022 3:30 am
Goliath wrote: Fri Jun 17, 2022 11:12 am As long as this badge counts passive infusion (and thus can be earned by playing normally), I'm 100% on-board with it.
Disagree. Lots of badges require a skill to be bought and actioned to grind them, this is the same.
Including passive infusion would mean getting the infusion badge incidentally, which doesn't make sense.
Lots of badges are bad design, so, argument negated.
That's like, your opinion, man.
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Klapaucius
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Re: The state of infusion

Post by Klapaucius »

:evil: I have a couple of thoughts and reflections to add to this discussion. Firstly, a brief response to some comments by others:
Wassail wrote: Sun Jun 12, 2022 5:22 pm incentivize more interesting gameplay and strategies as already described above and remove some of the 'gaminess' right now

Keep tile flipping XP, given to the passive infuser. This further incentivizes claiming and boots on the ground. Not sure if infusion would still bounce but if it does and that flips no XP for that.
Yes exactly, and really like the second idea! XP and grind stats - make being part of the war something people are properly encouraged to do. Successful hiding in enemy territory -> infusion, xp, and grind stats. Hiding in home territory -> less of all the above. Hanging out in the SH -> much safer, but much less bonus, particularly once the surrounding tiles get fully infused.

This would have the secondary benefit of fairly regularly reminding people about the war, and keeping that aspect of the game slightly more present in players minds which I think is cool.
Lychwood wrote: Sun Jun 12, 2022 1:14 pm If this is supposed to be a meta-goal everyone is invested in, then everyone should be able to meaningfully engage with it.
This is eloquently captures the crux of the topic IMO. I have a corollary: it should be rewarding for both the groups and individuals who choose to do so.

Secondly, some comments on specific skills, interactions and recent developments:

Nerf to dingus of conquest
I think this is unfortunate, because it significantly reduces the power of the nice little accuracy bonus/malus part of the skill, to the point where it's not going to be doing a lot of work as a combat buff, without stopping the skill being used to absolutely wreck enemy infusion on raids by spamming it. I appreciate the direction, but I still think the paradigm needs to be reconsidered (obviously when and if there's development motivation to work on things in that direction).

Wizard claim dominion
Literally gives wizards 4x the infusion power of 'normal' classes when doing active infusion. I know it's not usually voted in by the council, but that's totally cooked. One character shouldn't be worth 4 other characters in this space. Double from greater infusion is already huge, this seems a excessive to me. Also 10 XP/AP without even having to think about working for it, if an archmage needs ranks/wants to refund skills.
Edit: I have been informed that active infusion is only doubled, so x4 instead of x7. Reduced the numbers here commensurately.

Also 5x when doing random grinding activities like target shooting is excessive, and the combo with conquest remains totally usable (though I acknowledge that it means the EH is now spending a fair bit of AP and MP to get that extra infusion).

Purg forcing transcended infusion
The way this works is beyond punishing for non transcended groups trying to move into purg. I agree it should be an uphill battle (it already absolutely is for anyone trying to move into ely/styg), but this basically means your transcended characters in the SH are actively hurting you. At the very least it would be nice to stop characters from counterinfusing their own SH tile.
Last edited by Klapaucius on Wed Jul 06, 2022 12:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
Lychwood
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Re: The state of infusion

Post by Lychwood »

Here are some very rough concepts I've been noodling on. Just as a warning, I'm bad with numbers and balance. I'm not attempting to have all the math work out on the first go. This is more of a concept pitch to see if the ideas sound interesting in the first place. Ok, so with that said:

Outposts

Goal:
To create a raid-like territory conflict system that encourages live multiplayer activity. It would essentially take the form of a prolonged raid defense in enemy territory, provoked by an invading faction.

Premise:
The aggressor team sets up an “outpost” in a disputed territory. This outpost functions similarly to a Stronghold, but without a ward. Once placed, the Outpost begins a countdown timer (6h, maybe? 12h?). The tile must be actively defended during this time period—if there are no players of appropriate alignment alive on-tile before the countdown finishes, the Outpost will be destroyed. If the Outpost survives, it begins to automatically passive infuse the tiles around it within a certain radius. Once constructed, the Outpost will remain standing unless the tile is defused from its controlling alignment.

This would work like a base defense game. While the countdown is still active, the Outpost is still being built and only thing different about the tile is the ability for same-aligned players to build and benefit from fortifications. This would mean that the defenders would have the upper hand in any live combat, however they would be vulnerable any time they weren't actively watching the game. This would naturally lend itself toward alliance-level participation. Guarding a wardless tile for that long would ultimately require multiple factions to keep watch over the space.

Outpost Function:
  • The outpost may only be placed on lightly infused (<100) territory. This would mean that your deeply infused heartlands would generally be safe, but tenuously held claims would be at risk.
  • The ability to set an Outpost is bought by factions using hefty sums of renown, calculated as a limiter to prevent spamming. The Outpost must then be activated by a leader-level member of the faction.
  • Each neighborhood would have a maximum number of outposts that may be placed in its borders, corresponding with the size of the neighborhood.
During the countdown:
  • Generates a “status” visible to all players on tile, indicating the amount of time left in the countdown.
  • No ward
  • The outpost may be fortified in the same manner as a stronghold
  • Will collapse if no players of the corresponding alignment are on-tile during a game tick.
  • Lightly infuses the target tile over time: (2 infusion per tick? Just something to show for your time spent, even if you ultimately lose)
After the countdown
  • No ward
  • Outpost now permanent unless the tile is defused
  • Allows fortification
  • Allows local safe storage with 300 space, accessible to all players of the appropriate alignment (or maybe just the initiating faction?)
  • Infuses tiles within a 2-tile radius:
    (This may be wildly out of whack in either direction. Please consider all numbers placeholders for the sake of discussion).
    -3 infusion/tick on the Outpost tile
    -2 infusion/tick in all adjacent tiles
    -1 infusion/tick in all tiles on the outer radius.
Comments:
I see these outposts as infusion content the whole faction/alliance can play together, and sort of the unit-level conflict in the territory battle. It would be an alternative to raiding that can be played in a broader timespan with participation from players who might not be able to align their schedules to be online concurrently with the bulk of their faction. With forts, an outpost should be able to withstand a lot of aggression once it has been spotted. That being said, with a long enough countdown there will naturally be periods of high vulnerability as the defenders can’t spend the entire time watching Nexus. This would mean counterplay is still possible if the defenders don’t have enough brute force to clear the tile. Once established, an Outpost would be a little more stubborn to be rid of, but manageable—it doesn’t take too much effort to defuse down a single tile. It would also serve as a utility hub for allied players looking for shelter or gear.
Last edited by Lychwood on Wed Jul 06, 2022 12:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Lychwood
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Re: The state of infusion

Post by Lychwood »

Neighborhood Cults

Goals:
-Bring back planar guilds in a more organized format
-Design territory-related boons for players who aren't DOs or friends with DOs

Premise:
When a neighborhood is controlled in majority by one of the three Alignments, they may consecrate the ground to one of the EPs in their alignment. While inside the boundaries of that neighborhood, all members of the corresponding alignment would benefit from a boon associated with the chosen Elder Power.

Function:
Selection
The boon selection process would be performed by factions with a Stronghold in the neighborhood. Without a faction in the neighborhood, the boon is assigned randomly amongst the eligible Elder Powers. In the event that there is one or more eligible faction in the neighborhood, all players of those factions will be given the option to vote using a similar interface to the Archmage policy vote. The cult dedication would be confirmed every day on the Day Tick while the neighborhood is still claimed >60%.

The Boons
I know that former Planar guilds were dedicated to many different entities and concepts. I think for the sake of balance and simplicity, it would be easiest to start with three options for each alignment: Alonai/Baraas/Namm, Marquai/Goros/Hashaa, Tlac/Thol/Ahg.

Frankly, I'm not going to try and come up with a full array of balanced boons for every side. It would be bad. A mess. I'm just going to leave the concept framework for sharper minds to consider.

Ex:
Hashaa - While it is consecrated to Hashaa, all players killed in this neighborhood have a 10% chance to rise as an aggressive zombie. Players of (or factioned with) the corresponding Alignment will not be targeted.
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